22 thoughts on “General debate, June 9, 2013

  1. It is a bit of a mystery to me that the Greens, and Labour are pursuing Dunne, for putting a bit of disinfecting sunlight on the GCSB.

    There are plenty of examples of self serving crap from Dunne to attack.

    BUT. Making Government more open, whatever the underlying motive, is something that should get principled encouragement from the Greens.

    Are some Green politicians getting captured by parliamentary groupthink?. Like the unfortunate endorsement of CERA?

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  2. I wonder, Kerry, if the issue is the contents of Dunne’s emails to Vance, and anything he might have said about the spy document and those who really leaked it? It would be awfully embarrassing if it came from Key’s office and Dunne had told Vance about it.
    Pure speculation mind. What would I know?

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  3. I wonder, Kerry, if the issue is the contents of Dunne’s emails to Vance

    I suspect there is something more embarrassing in there; something more than would warrant him on one hand, saying on public TV that he didn’t release the file, and on the other, refusing to let David Henry sight un-redacted content.

    So either;

    (a) he’s a liar, did release the content and didn’t show the emails, and for some reason thought he could bluff his way through, or

    (b) he’s telling the truth, didn’t release the content and didn’t show the emails, because he is compromised by some other content but felt his relationship was strong enough with the Key that he would brush it off. Big mistake.

    I suspect (b) but we’ll never know.
    Neither Dunne or Vance will say anything.

    More to the point, what kind of idiot would send 84 emails to a journo – assuming it contained something sensitive – from a parliamentary email?

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  4. We all know Dunne is an idiot.

    Exposing the sort of stupidity engaged in by so called “intelligence” services, and politicians, who think the world should work like a Tom Clancy novel, is however, something that should be encouraged.

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  5. Kerry Thomas

    …for putting a bit of disinfecting sunlight on the GCSB.

    Wasn’t the Kitteridge report (PDF) going to be released anyway? Leaking a document that highlights how the GCSB has likely acted unlawfully while the Minister responsible is out of the country only benefits that minister. Can you guess who that Minister is Kerry Thomas?

    Greenfly

    Pure speculation mind. What would I know?

    I think your speculations have been proven correct on more occasions than photonz’s “statements of fact” than I would like to number. Lets just say that there’s a direct connection between the Office of the Prime Minster and Peter Dunne deciding to be the fall guy.

    Gregor W

    (a) he’s a liar, did release the content and didn’t show the emails, and for some reason thought he could bluff his way through, or

    (b) he’s telling the truth, didn’t release the content and didn’t show the emails, because he is compromised by some other content but felt his relationship was strong enough with the Key that he would brush it off. Big mistake.

    There is always option (c). He didn’t release the report but showed somebody else where it was. BTW the report was likely released in electronic format in which a third person would have no trouble in transferring.

    Therefore he didn’t specifically release the report, but has chosen to hide the emails that directed somebody else in locating the report in question before it was due to be released.

    In my opinion, the police enquiry should focus around there being a reason (in law) for a delayed release of government information. In either case, democracy should win. Either there’s no reason for information to be retained by the government until a specific due date, or Dunne is found guilty and is removed from parliament.

    Either way, the Greens should not feel that they’re losing a potential future coalition partner, but rather that they’re disposing of somebody who has been propping up a defunct and fascist government.

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  6. Kim dotcom for minister of revenue!
    (Psst….and minister in charge of GCSB….)

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  7. One may surmise that something in those e-mails is NOT related to the GCSB, but to something else which Dunne is even more ashamed of. His word choices and actions are peculiar.

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  8. Those who are brave enough to argue about the need for action on climate are welcome to try their luck. Simple downticks on this topic aren’t really meaningful… ARE they ;-)

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  9. Not sure it means anything or is present North of the Equator, but the local energy companies seem to be spending big on the feel-good adverts around here just now.

    Gas is the future.
    We can get at more oil using new technology.

    That sort of thing.

    Which doesn’t really seem to have much to do with their bottom line or their customer base.

    Is there a purpose, if so what?

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  10. “something else which Dunne is even more ashamed of. His word choices and actions are peculiar.”

    After 30 boring boring boring years in Parliament he suddenly found that an attractive and intelligent journalist showed some interest in a report he had in his briefcase and he felt especially interesting for once.

    I suspect he spent extra time on his bowtie and hairdo that day.

    Now he is embarrassed about his silly puffery and resulting security lapse. No sexual misconduct here, just excess vanity and eventual embarrassment. That’s my reading of it anyway.

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  11. Thirty minutes through this (nearly two hour) video, and enjoying it. Quite thought provoking.

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  12. Actually, I think Andrew was disingenuous as to the content of that video, its more a difference of opinion about where doing right by the environment will lead us.

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  13. And in other news, Greece suspends state broadcaster ERT to save money, from the BBC.

    Found out about it on Facebook, I have a Brit friend who lived in Greece for many years, and is thus well connected with the place; apparently those reporters who are not now jobless are on strike as a protest, and thus the event isn’t being reported upon…?

    Yep, striking, that’ll work well.

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  14. BJ,

    Read that NY Times link with interest. Seems MSM is getting the “financialisation” angle.

    There is a greater (in my view) underlying problem in that the general populace wants their cake and eat it too.

    Read this as a typical piece

    http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.co.nz/2013/06/fierce-selloff-in-emerging-market.html#echocomments

    By the way, all this extremely volatile currency action, as well as various equity and bond market bubbles, can be pinned entirely on central banks, fractional reserve lending, and lack of a gold standard.

    To which a certain commentator made this insightful observation.

    I beg to differ with Mish’s view that increasing volatility and economic weakness “can be pinned entirely on central banks, fractional reserve lending, and lack of a gold standard.” This mixes up cause and effect.

    In the same way that it is wrong to blame heroine dealers for a surge in drug addiction it is likewise wrong to blame economic and currency problems on central banks and fractional reserve lending. Yes, dope dealers are scum, but they don’t CAUSE the underlying societal problems that lead people to seek addiction.

    Central banks and fractional reserve lending serve the same enabling role to the economy as drug dealers do to addicts. Central banks provide the heroine that societies DEMAND due to their desire to avoid any pain and have their cakes while they eat them. To put it another way – central bank policies closely follow the “mood” of society.

    I am certainly not going to defend central banks (just as I would NEVER defend a street tough pushing heroine), but I think it is simplistic to just blame central banks and policy makers for the economic problems we face. Heck, you can have bubbles even when there are no central banks. There have also been periods of massive inflation/deflation when currencies were based on silver (e.g. there was huge inflation when Spanish silver from the Americas flooded the global markets). Bubbles are a phenomena of the herding instinct inherent to the human species and economies move in cycles, oscillating between fear and greed to varying degrees in both the long and short term.

    The simple fact is that we are entering the blow off phase of a multi-generational bullish phase of societal mood. We are now going through the lengthy process of crushing those bullish feelings with despair and conservatism which will be the hallmark of the next 100 year (or so) cycle. I don’t think it is a coincidence that we are on the precipice of a major economic depression just when the survivors of the last great depression in the 1930s are dying off. We repeat the mistakes of the past when those who lived through those calamities are no longer alive.

    Just like a drug dealer can only operate as long as the customers buys their products, so federal bank, fiat banking, etc. exists because the people “buy” into their products.

    So while the banks and federal control can be seen as providing the same “service” to people as drug pushers. They are not the cause of the problem.

    And just like the war on drugs will only be won when the people stop using, so will the banks and financial institution fall.

    I concur with the commentator that we will see a collapse into recession and enter a “fear” phase.

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  15. “… but making FAKE money has nothing to do with doing work and damages the economy for everyone else.”

    I presume you’re against printing money as a monetary policy then :)

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