by frog
Unleash the mayhem!
Some stuff I’ve come across today
Mexicans sending money to relatives in the US
General debate, 2nd Dec, 2009
Published: December 2, 2009
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Please use 
on the trolls and those who are unable to keep on topic
Isn’t Pollard (whoever he is) absolutely FOS!
As if technological advances just stop…
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So the Brown ‘mofo’ gets away with insulting ever single white person in NZ and not a word is heard from the Greens.
Toad even wants Goff to apologise for telling the truth.
Still, at least now I know I have the option of calling all Maorim brown mofo and not get into trouble.
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The technological advances you are familiar with have not changed in any large degree the efficiencies of heating homes, heating water, hauling mass across oceans, hauling mass across continents or any of the bulk processes of power engineering.
It is a common mistake for people in the Computer world to make. Moores law is still working… but computers process information, they don’t convert energy into work or fuel into energy… they don’t have to obey Carnot’s laws, and are only vaguely limited by thermodynamics (as in when your cooling fan packs it in). You can’t live in a computer, it won’t feed you, it can’t (generally) keep your house warm and while you can SEE stuff from far away, someone has to pack it and send it to you for you to actually HAVE it. The underlying machinery has not changed a lot in the past half-century.
Technological advances of the sort needed are called “breakthroughs” and you can’t predict or plan on them appearing when you need them. You don’t believe civilization can collapse because you think the scientists are going to come up with something. You are trusting the scientists and engineers to save your butt with some new miracle. This engineer is telling you that if you bet on this you are drawing to an inside straight.
So you may have missed the differences between the incremental increases on the power side, and the orders-of-magnitude changes everywhere else. We aren’t keeping up with population… all we are doing is burning more and more fuel.
BJ
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Is electricity a miracle? Anyone would think we’d forgotten how to generate the stuff! In fact, we get better and better at it, as history shows.
I guess I just have more faith in our abilities than BJ and Pollard, who obviously doesn’t get invited to many parties as is obviously quite bitter about it.
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Handy “Guide to understanding the Right” http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/
No, despite all indications to the contrary, the Right wingers are not merely dumb as bricks… actually they are reasonably smart, but are, to us, rather strange and misled in curious ways.
He gives many interesting results to aid in understanding them and their leaders and concrete suggestions to reduce the harm they cause.
Alas, since the main problem in North America is the far right, he concentrates exclusively on them without more than an acknowledgement of the existence of similar problems of the far left.
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The left aren’t authoritarian?
Why are they always trying to ban and tax everything, then?
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Q: Why is Don Brash called a racist for saying that everyone should be treated equally, whilst Hone is given a holiday for calling white people land raping motherfockers?
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BluePeter sayeth…
The left aren’t authoritarian?
I suspect Right vs Left is a bit of a “red” herring.
The real problem around here is where people stand on this scale…
I’d be curious to know whether you’d agree or disagree strongly or otherwise with these statements..
1. Some groups of people are simply inferior to other groups.
2. In getting what you want, it is sometimes necessary to use force against other groups.
3. It’s OK if some groups have more of a chance in life than others.
4. To get ahead in life, it is sometimes necessary to step on other groups.
5. If certain groups stayed in their place, we would have fewer problems.
6. It’s probably a good thing that certain groups are at the top and other groups are at the bottom.
7. Inferior groups should stay in their place.
8. Sometimes other groups must be kept in their place.
9. It would be good if groups could be equal.
10. Group equality should be our ideal.
11. All groups should be given an equal chance in life.
12. We should do what we can to equalize conditions for different groups.
13. Increased social equality.
14. We would have fewer problems if we treated people more equally.
15. We should strive to make incomes as equal as possible.
16. No group should dominate in society.
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I’m not happy with the term “groups”
Very left-wing concept….leads to identity politics…
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crikey..!
that civilisation-meltdown-timeline thing is kinda chilling..!
phil(whoar.co.nz)
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It’s pure nonsense, Phil. Why do green doomsday cultists want this catastrophic “cleansing” of humanity so badly? It’s very old testament. People will simply adapt to changing inputs, as we always do.
For a more intelligent take on the future, suggest you read “The Meaning Of The 21st Century” by James Martin.
Balanced greens will like it, actually.
The doomsday nitwits won’t.
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And you know what, I don’t see “gay marriage” in there at all.
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this is for b.j..
and anyone else with the vile habit of using emoticons..
http://whoar.co.nz/2009/death-to-smiley-why-emoticons-need-to-die/
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…
…
…eh!
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Fool! God is punishing us all for being wicked!
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Copenhagen! Exciting isn’t it! Key might go – gosh!!!
Doesn’t want to be seen as being out of step with the rest of the world!
Dork!
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@big bro 3.54 PM
But Hone didn’t call all Pakeha white mofos bruv – he was referring to those who fought the wars and made the laws to rip off Maori land over the last 170 years – not those whiteys like me who have stood by Maori in opposition to that. So I was not offended (other than by the use of the mofo term, which is misogynist, and Hone’s been around stroppy women long enough to know that term is almost as unacceptable as “nigger”.
Anyway, BB, on one topic we are usually mutually agreed on, can we win the second Test without Bond?
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Hone’s ‘expletive filled email’ – wasn’t there just the one … expletive?
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Harawira must now play by the rules of the party…
Wasn’t that always the case?
Hone rules that roost!
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Universities take action on Climategate: Investigating academic fraud by global-warming theocracy
“Pennsylvania State University announced it was launching an investigation into the academic conduct of Michael Mann, director of the school’s Earth System Science Center. Yesterday, it was announced that Phil Jones, director of the Climatic Research Unit (CRU) at the University of East Anglia, would step aside while his university conducts an investigation. With so much fraud being exposed in the academic community that studies and promotes global-warming theories, an example has to be made of someone.
There are dozens of researchers at other institutions involved in this scandal surrounding leaked e-mails that discuss covering up evidence of global cooling and destroying research that discounts global warming. ”
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/dec/02/universities-take-action-on-climategate/
CLIMATE CHANGE ROCKED
http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/143573/Climate-change-rocked-
Climate scientists subverted peer review
“The last IPCC compendium on climate science, published in 2007, left out plenty of peer-reviewed science that it found inconveniently disagreeable. These include articles from the journals Arctic, Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society, Earth Interactions, Geophysical Research Letters, International Journal of Climatology, Journal of Climate, Journal of Geophysical Research, Nature, Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, and Quaternary Research. ”
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columns/OpEd-Contributor/Climate-scientists-subverted-peer-review-8613054-78248872.html
Botch after botch after botch: Leaked ‘climategate’ documents show huge flaws in the backbone of climate change science
http://www.torontosun.com/comment/columnists/lorrie_goldstein/2009/11/29/11967916-sun.html
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wat,
good to see the WT has gotten it correct – Phil stepped aside to enable independent oversight.. how come I can’t say the same about you? Oh, and “theories” – whose uncertain now?
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John Carter,
Amazed I am.. to realise that anyone here – YOU – could be apprised of the Post-Modern Compendium (an early version of which I contributed to — which explains how I know your terminology and intent)
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As usual Wat overstates the case immensely. I welcome the investigations into Mann and Jones… expecting Mann to be closer to the center of the problem than Jones was, but not particularly fond of either.
What this doesn’t do is alter the science. More openness will be good, as the smokescreens of the doubt manufacturers will be exposed for what they are.
respectfully
BJ
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“In my previous post on Climategate I blithely said that nothing in the climate science email dump surprised me much. Having waded more deeply over the weekend I take that back.
The closed-mindedness of these supposed men of science, their willingness to go to any lengths to defend a preconceived message, is surprising even to me. The stink of intellectual corruption is overpowering. And, as Christopher Booker argues, this scandal is not at the margins of the politicised IPCC process. It is not tangential to the policy prescriptions emanating from what David Henderson called the environmental policy milieu. It goes to the core of that process.”
http://blogs.ft.com/crookblog/2009/11/more-on-climategate/
Yep.
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If the system collapsed and we reverted to a command and control economy we would be dependant on our connections. Dissenting ideas just wouldn’t get a hearing (or require suppression).
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You can vote for copenhagen to work. Check the bottom of the page.
http://unfccc.int/meetings/cop_15/virtual_participation/items/5092.php
I note with some asperity however, that they provide no ballot box for the “no” votes. !!!
Which means that the exercise is actually completely pointless. I suspect that the world’s ability to vote being limited to those with computers, so it is even more pointless. Yes, we are into negative relevance here, so as exciting as it may be to vote, the results will be disinformative ( confuse the issue ). Having seen disinformation in many forms, I can scarcely fail to recognize it.
Even when “my” side does it.
respectfully
BJ
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This however, is where I think we are.
It is basically a call to arms.
I note that he prefers “Fee and Dividend” to “Cap and Trade” … which is likely to be far more effective than the current ETS thing is. Heck… a sprinkling of fairy dust would be more effective than the current ETS legislation.
respectfully
BJ
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BluePeter sayeth…”I’m not happy with the term “groups””
Okay. No problem. So search and replace every occurrence of the word “group” in the questionaire by “individual” and answer it.
And then I suspect we’ll get to the core of our differences. ie. Why no argument of the Greens convinces you… and why none of your arguments convinces the average Greenie.
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Tom Farmer yodalike said…Amazed I am.. to realise that anyone here – YOU – could be apprised of the Post-Modern Compendium
So be one notch more. Or less. Amazed.
I’m not aware of any post modern compendium.
I got the notion from Altemey’s book and the rest, via a quick bit of Googling, from Wikipedia.
Alas, “Tom Farmer” must be, for sound historical reasons, one of the most common English names, which makes Google rather unhelpful in trying to find out more “Post modern compendiums”.
Could you provide a link?
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John Carter – on the blue button.
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The Rata trees look like they are going to flower well this year – absolutely bleedin covered in buds they are.
I will enjoy seeing them clearly for the first time with my “optical aids” I got glasses for driving but now can’t take the damned things off! so much to see!
So Northern rata are going to have a heavy flowering but I am hoping that Southern Rata will follow suit in a few months time, easily the most vibrant of all Metrosideros flowers. Any one ever seen Otira gorge in full flower? absolutely magnificent.
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1. Some people are simply inferior to other people.
Yes. Graeme Burton is inferior to most because of his actions.
2. In getting what you want, it is sometimes necessary to use force against people.
Yes. If you want peace and some maniac is shooting children, then I have no problems shooting said maniac.
3. It’s OK if some people have more of a chance in life than others.
Irrelevant if it’s ok, it’s life. Brad Pitt is better looking than most men – so he’s more likely to become a movie star/model.
4. To get ahead in life, it is sometimes necessary to step on other people.
Again, it happens. We all do it. See Green leadership battle….
5. If certain people stayed in their place, we would have fewer problems.
Obviously.
6. It’s probably a good thing that certain people are at the top and other people are at the bottom.
Again, that’s nature. Some people are more capable than others. You don’t want a cretin designing a bridge, do you?
7. Inferior people should stay in their place.
No. They can do what they like, but all people should expect to be challenged by nature/others.
8. Sometimes other people must be kept in their place.
Would you like Graeme Burton as your new room-mate?
9. It would be good if people could be equal.
Utopian, and therefore silly.
10. equality should be our ideal.
It’s one of those nice ideas you know you can never reach. I see this blog dumped on Palin supporters, mainly out of sense of intellectual superiority.
11. All people should be given an equal chance in life.
Impossible. They should be given as many opportunities to climb ladders as is reasonable.
12. We should do what we can to equalize conditions for different people.
Within reason.
13. Increased social equality.
I think we should accept that people are different and work with that reality.
14. We would have fewer problems if we treated people more equally.
Probably, but again it’s one of those utopian ideals. Should Brad Pitt “ugly down” to make it fairer on the rest of us?
15. We should strive to make incomes as equal as possible.
Definitely not. Some people don’t provide much in the way of value. Why should a surgeon earn only slightly more than a beneficary?
16. No group should dominate in society.
No. Peaceful people should dominate over scum.
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Shunda – now that you’re cured of your short-sighteness, you seem obsessed by the colour red. Are you over blue?
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Now I see that John Key’s stubborn refusal to go to Copenhagen is crumbling, just like his refusal to help developing countries with finance. A Johnny-come-lately perhaps?
Hah!
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0912/S00005.htm
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BP
What is the source of your assertions? Is this your own philosophical take on the world or is it linked to something else. I would like to know before I answer, if there is anything expanding on these statements. (Some are agreed, others are not).
respectfully
BJ
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philosophical take
That’s good bj.
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11. All people should be given an equal chance in life.
Impossible. They should be given as many opportunities to climb ladders as is reasonable.
What’s the dif?
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BJ – I tried to answer them honestly. If it’s ideology you’re looking for, I guess it’s a mixed bag.
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The word “equal” is complicated…
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Stephen,
To give everyone an equal chance would mean to hit the smart ones over the head and the attractive ones in the face. To give them as many opportunities as is practical is to make a society which is conductive of advancement through personal effort and cultivation rather than just inheritance and unchangable personal traits. It is to recognise that to make all equal is to bring all to the lowest denominator; that leaving no children behind leaves all children behind
.
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Sapient – an ugly bloke in a community of uglier blokes is equal to a good looking guy amongst a crowd of quite good lookers – yes?
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i’m calling a humour-break..!
this is vid of british soldiers tripping on acid..in a military experiment..
..in 1963..
http://whoar.co.nz/2009/soldiers-on-acid-1963-british-video-shows-troops-under-the-influence-of-lsd/
(warning!:..very funny..!..)
check the faux-bbc accent in the commentary..!
..brilliant..!
phil(whoar.co.nz)
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“Shunda – now that you’re cured of your short-sighteness, you seem obsessed by the colour red. Are you over blue? ”
Ha! You are a clever bug-er aren’t you, no such luck just yet, mind you, if big Gerry goes near those Rata……
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That’s OK BP, I guess I was just wondering “why THESE questions?” given all the possible choices… I’ve got business at present, will respond more substantively later. No criticism intended … yet
ciao
BJ
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Sorry, I see it now. John Carter is asking it.
No worries.
BJ
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With such a weak ETS to present,
how is Key going to copeinhagen?
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Greenfly,
Equal when compared to standard deviations above the norm perhaps. Not so equal when the she-sheeple (ewes?) come alooking for a mate.
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Sapient – when ewes-ones come a courtin’, they’re likely gonna pass-by the handsome nancy-boys, in favour of a gritty ‘thank the Lord she chose me’ bloke.
So… there’s several different brands of ‘equal’?
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Mmmmm Roast lamb.
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…cooked slowly over a rata-log fire and garnished with rata blossom – a real Kiwi treat!
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Greenfly,
Allow polygamy and she can have the best of both worlds. Let us remove the discrimination against ewe’. Decrease ram to ewe violence (though it would probally increase ewe-ewe and ewe to ram violence).
Im a monogamous one myself, but I can see certain eugenic benefits to polygamy.
Do ewe see where I am coming from?
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A Genius that Sapient.
‘That is Not a Shepherd grazing his sheep – it’s a muslim taking his wives out for dinner.’
That’s what I told ‘em anyway.
Honest Hone’s not wrong – but he shouldn’t take disenfranchisement personally – welcome to the Club Hone – and get back in line will you?
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Polygamy?
Sort of ‘all ewe can eat’?
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Seas could rise 1.4m, warns Antarctic climate review
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn18218-seas-could-rise-14m-warns-antarctic-climate-review.html?DCM
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I see that one in seven NZ Maori has migrated to Australia compared to one in eight pakeha.
I wonder what the percentage of Australian Maori are in prison compared to the NZ Maori.
I suspect that fewer Maori (as a percentage of population) are in Australian prisons that Australians are.
Could someone do the stats?
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I’m not sure that the ‘stats’ would be very helpful.
Firstly there is the assumption that the Australian and New Zealand courts have virtually identical incarceration criteria. That in itself would be very difficult to ascertain.
Also, it is very likely that the ‘moral behaviour’ of immigrants to Australia does not mirror that of the corresponding resident New Zealand citizen.
What exactly are we trying to show here? If less than one in seven (Austalian) Maoris are in prision, does that mean that the Australian ecomony is better for Maori than here in New Zealand? Isn’t it more likely that we in New Zealand have already jailed much of the Maori criminal element?
My gut feeling is that it’s likely that the number of Maoris living in Australia would need to have around 90% of them being at least 3rd generation Australian before a fair comparision could be made. And even then the two countries would need virtually identical incarceration criteria.
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I suspect that many Maori migrate to Australia for the same reason my ancestors migrated from Ireland to NZ – to escape from a tribal society to one where all stood equal on the ground. As Belich says in his latest book these early settlers were Settles – not colonisers.
In New Zealand my ancestors found catholics could marry protestants and ones religion did not determine everything you did or could do.
When I taught MBA classes at the AU and AIS I often had Maori students (adults) who have been to the US or Australia and had achieved great things and then come back full of plans to do great things on their ancestral land. Only to be frustrated by their peers. Most of the students at the Auckland Institute of StudiesStudieswere Chinese or from other Asian countries. It was fascinating to see the changing attitudes to their future career path of the Chinese students as conditions in their own homeland changed.
I just think it would be interesting to know the motivations of the people who migrate to Australia – and of Maori in particular. A nice thesis in cultural anthropology for someone.
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How “climategate” looks from the perspective of science? –
http://carbonfixated.com/newtongate-the-final-nail-in-the-coffin-of-renaissance-and-enlightenment-thinking/
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it’s been four days..!
this gd thread is like an over-recycled tissue…
waiter..!
phil(whoar.co.nz)
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Second the motion. Yo ! Frog!
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and as a big fat full-stop..
here is a must-watch..
it is cap and trade explained..in simple terms..
(it won’t give you a headache..but will disturb in other ways..)
and it has been done by annie leonard..who is the autuer of that other like-changing/must-see..’the story of stuff’..
http://whoar.co.nz/2009/the-story-of-cap-and-trade-more-scam-than-solutionfree-permits-to-big-polluters-fake-offsets-and-distraction-from-whats-really-required-to-tackle-the-climate-crisis/
phil(whoar.co.nz)
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