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	<title>Comments on: ACC cuts put home care workers below minimum wage</title>
	<atom:link href="http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/</link>
	<description>hopping along the corridors of power</description>
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		<title>By: Landa</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95917</link>
		<dc:creator>Landa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Nov 2009 03:12:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95917</guid>
		<description>I do wish Green would stop being so pretend-pious about the poor workers and how they ought to be given more.   Can anyone, anywhere, really believe this stuff?

I know that is the classic leftwing strategy for attracting votes, get on your soapbox and offer extra cash to people too stupid to understand the unwritten agenda, but honestly!   Green is supposed to be more intelligent than that.   All this piteous wailing is not necessary.

The answer lies in their own hands.   Either drop that job and get another, or start their own little business.

What is to stop any homecare worker from starting their own little homecare service business?   It takes:  one bucket, four cleaning rags, and a pencil and slips of paper to put in letterboxes.   Then they can raise their income to $20 per hour, easy.   Many home cleaners charge a lot more than that.

And … puh-lease!   No marches down the street asking for government start-up grants and job creation subsidies.   Anybody who is too witless or lazy to get out there with a bucket and cloth and slip Work Skills Offered notes into every letterbox is, frankly, not worthy of support. 

As for the ILO, I’m waiting to see how much it does for the REALLY poor people, the ones on a dollar a day or less, who are barely managing to eat.

And the ACC - oh, mercy, don’t get me started.   

What, you actually WANT that foul scheme, which is the joy of every drug company from Honolulu to Hong Kong, because it makes kiwis into helpless experimental subjects???   They can use their doctor force to dish out any drug, any at all and, no matter how destructive and deadly the outcome, we cannot sue them.   

Oh, what happy little drug company executives the New Zealand ACC scheme makes them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I do wish Green would stop being so pretend-pious about the poor workers and how they ought to be given more.   Can anyone, anywhere, really believe this stuff?</p>
<p>I know that is the classic leftwing strategy for attracting votes, get on your soapbox and offer extra cash to people too stupid to understand the unwritten agenda, but honestly!   Green is supposed to be more intelligent than that.   All this piteous wailing is not necessary.</p>
<p>The answer lies in their own hands.   Either drop that job and get another, or start their own little business.</p>
<p>What is to stop any homecare worker from starting their own little homecare service business?   It takes:  one bucket, four cleaning rags, and a pencil and slips of paper to put in letterboxes.   Then they can raise their income to $20 per hour, easy.   Many home cleaners charge a lot more than that.</p>
<p>And … puh-lease!   No marches down the street asking for government start-up grants and job creation subsidies.   Anybody who is too witless or lazy to get out there with a bucket and cloth and slip Work Skills Offered notes into every letterbox is, frankly, not worthy of support. </p>
<p>As for the ILO, I’m waiting to see how much it does for the REALLY poor people, the ones on a dollar a day or less, who are barely managing to eat.</p>
<p>And the ACC &#8211; oh, mercy, don’t get me started.   </p>
<p>What, you actually WANT that foul scheme, which is the joy of every drug company from Honolulu to Hong Kong, because it makes kiwis into helpless experimental subjects???   They can use their doctor force to dish out any drug, any at all and, no matter how destructive and deadly the outcome, we cannot sue them.   </p>
<p>Oh, what happy little drug company executives the New Zealand ACC scheme makes them.
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95917" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95917', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95917-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95917" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95917', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95917-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">3</small> (<small id="karma-95917-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">-3</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: SPC</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95535</link>
		<dc:creator>SPC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 03:54:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95535</guid>
		<description>Toad

Is there compensation for the costs of the travel itself - petrol, car insurance and depreciation on a work related vehicle?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Toad</p>
<p>Is there compensation for the costs of the travel itself &#8211; petrol, car insurance and depreciation on a work related vehicle?
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95535" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95535', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95535-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95535" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95535', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95535-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95535-total" >0</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: bjchip</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95495</link>
		<dc:creator>bjchip</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 20:14:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95495</guid>
		<description>They have the Dubya constituency, &quot;the haves and have mores&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>They have the Dubya constituency, &#8220;the haves and have mores&#8221;
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95495" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95495', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95495-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">2</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95495" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95495', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95495-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95495-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">+2</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: frog</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95491</link>
		<dc:creator>frog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 19:48:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95491</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve just been sent a &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/AK0911/S00165.htm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;media release&lt;/a&gt; from Rural Women NZ on this issue - must have missed it when it came out on Monday.  

&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Rural Women New Zealand says ACC travel cuts short-sighted&lt;/strong&gt;

Rural Women New Zealand is disappointed at the recent decision by ACC to cut travel payments to home-based support workers. 

&quot;The decision to remove payments for the first 20kms travelled by a support worker to an ACC client will inevitably adversely impact on delivery of services to the rural sector,&quot; says RWNZ health spokesperson, Marie Appleton. 

Rural workers feature particularly highly in workforce accident statistics due to the physical nature of their work. 

&quot;The travel cost cuts will lead to a shortage of rural home care workers due to the kilometers they have to travel which will no longer be reimbursed.  It will hit them in the pocket, particularly with the higher costs of fuel,&quot; says Mrs Appleton. 

Rural Women New Zealand believes the move is short sighted and will end up costing the government more. 

&quot;It will make it even harder to recruit homecare workers, and will result in longer hospital stays if people cannot go home without support.&quot;&lt;/blockquote&gt;

A good point about the longer hospital stays - I didn&#039;t think of that one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="">I&#8217;ve just been sent a <a href="http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/AK0911/S00165.htm" rel="nofollow">media release</a> from Rural Women NZ on this issue &#8211; must have missed it when it came out on Monday.  </p>
<blockquote><p><strong>Rural Women New Zealand says ACC travel cuts short-sighted</strong></p>
<p>Rural Women New Zealand is disappointed at the recent decision by ACC to cut travel payments to home-based support workers. </p>
<p>&#8220;The decision to remove payments for the first 20kms travelled by a support worker to an ACC client will inevitably adversely impact on delivery of services to the rural sector,&#8221; says RWNZ health spokesperson, Marie Appleton. </p>
<p>Rural workers feature particularly highly in workforce accident statistics due to the physical nature of their work. </p>
<p>&#8220;The travel cost cuts will lead to a shortage of rural home care workers due to the kilometers they have to travel which will no longer be reimbursed.  It will hit them in the pocket, particularly with the higher costs of fuel,&#8221; says Mrs Appleton. </p>
<p>Rural Women New Zealand believes the move is short sighted and will end up costing the government more. </p>
<p>&#8220;It will make it even harder to recruit homecare workers, and will result in longer hospital stays if people cannot go home without support.&#8221;</p></blockquote>
<p>A good point about the longer hospital stays &#8211; I didn&#8217;t think of that one.</p></div>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95491" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95491', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95491-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">3</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95491" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95491', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95491-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95491-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">+3</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: toad</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95484</link>
		<dc:creator>toad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 18:51:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95484</guid>
		<description>@Trevor29:

Often home care workers see 3 or 4 clients a day, doing 1 or two hours work for each - just doing the household tasks that the injured person can&#039;t do such as vacuuming, laundry, bedmaking etc.  In cases of very serious injuries, however, an injured person who needs constant care can be provided with 24 hour attendant care.  My understanding where a caregiver sees several different people in one day, the 20km applies to each trip.

@SPC:

I think the way they get around the minimum wage issue is by arguing that the caregiver is not actually working when they are travelling between the homes of the people they care for, so what they are being paid for that time is an allowance, rather than a wage.

And speaking of the ILO (although slightly off topic) New Zealand continues to be in breach of ILO Convention 17 by requiring injured workers to pay co-payments for the cost of treatment for work injuries, and the Government&#039;s moves to reintroduce co-payments for physiotherapy will make us even less compliant with that convention.  It might be worthwhile making a complaint to the ILO on that issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Trevor29:</p>
<p>Often home care workers see 3 or 4 clients a day, doing 1 or two hours work for each &#8211; just doing the household tasks that the injured person can&#8217;t do such as vacuuming, laundry, bedmaking etc.  In cases of very serious injuries, however, an injured person who needs constant care can be provided with 24 hour attendant care.  My understanding where a caregiver sees several different people in one day, the 20km applies to each trip.</p>
<p>@SPC:</p>
<p>I think the way they get around the minimum wage issue is by arguing that the caregiver is not actually working when they are travelling between the homes of the people they care for, so what they are being paid for that time is an allowance, rather than a wage.</p>
<p>And speaking of the ILO (although slightly off topic) New Zealand continues to be in breach of ILO Convention 17 by requiring injured workers to pay co-payments for the cost of treatment for work injuries, and the Government&#8217;s moves to reintroduce co-payments for physiotherapy will make us even less compliant with that convention.  It might be worthwhile making a complaint to the ILO on that issue.
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95484" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95484', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95484-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">1</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95484" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95484', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95484-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">1</small> (<small id="karma-95484-total" >0</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: SPC</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95458</link>
		<dc:creator>SPC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 08:05:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95458</guid>
		<description>This does not seem unfair in one way - everyone travels to work at their own expense (in their own time and the cost is out of their wages). 

But, I suspect the time compensation developed because of the multiple journeys, to such an extent that travel was part of the job time, so in that case it is unfair.    

The ILO takes a dim view of anyone being required to work below the legal minimum wage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This does not seem unfair in one way &#8211; everyone travels to work at their own expense (in their own time and the cost is out of their wages). </p>
<p>But, I suspect the time compensation developed because of the multiple journeys, to such an extent that travel was part of the job time, so in that case it is unfair.    </p>
<p>The ILO takes a dim view of anyone being required to work below the legal minimum wage.
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95458" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95458', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95458-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">0</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95458" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95458', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95458-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95458-total" >0</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: Trevor29</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95455</link>
		<dc:creator>Trevor29</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 07:36:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95455</guid>
		<description>What is the situation for a care worker that needs to see two or more patients in one day? Does the 20km apply to each patient or for the whole day? What if the patient needs assistance at the start and end of the day, so the care worker has to make two trips?

Trevor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="">What is the situation for a care worker that needs to see two or more patients in one day? Does the 20km apply to each patient or for the whole day? What if the patient needs assistance at the start and end of the day, so the care worker has to make two trips?</p>
<p>Trevor.</p></div>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95455" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95455', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95455-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">3</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95455" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95455', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95455-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95455-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">+3</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: Sapient</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95436</link>
		<dc:creator>Sapient</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 03:11:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95436</guid>
		<description>On the one side, if the travel is a requirement of the job then they should be getting paid at least minimum wage for the travel and should not have to pay for the costs of that travel. On the other side, pretty much every worker has to travel to get to work and these workers tend not to get paid for their travel time and tend not to have their fuel expenses paid for. Its difficult to work out which it should be. Though I would suggest that if the individual is employed by a body and is assigned to an individual then the actual place of employment is seperate from the place of work and thus the travel is an in-work expense and should be paid for. If it is, however, that they are employed specifically for that patient or effectivly by that patient but paid by ACC then that house becomes the place of work and the place of employment and thus they should not be paid. It is ultimately an arbitary distinction but points to a rather large discrepancy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>On the one side, if the travel is a requirement of the job then they should be getting paid at least minimum wage for the travel and should not have to pay for the costs of that travel. On the other side, pretty much every worker has to travel to get to work and these workers tend not to get paid for their travel time and tend not to have their fuel expenses paid for. Its difficult to work out which it should be. Though I would suggest that if the individual is employed by a body and is assigned to an individual then the actual place of employment is seperate from the place of work and thus the travel is an in-work expense and should be paid for. If it is, however, that they are employed specifically for that patient or effectivly by that patient but paid by ACC then that house becomes the place of work and the place of employment and thus they should not be paid. It is ultimately an arbitary distinction but points to a rather large discrepancy.
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95436" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95436', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95436-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">1</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95436" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95436', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95436-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95436-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">+1</small>)</p>
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		<title>By: katie</title>
		<link>http://blog.greens.org.nz/2009/11/10/acc-cuts-put-home-care-workers-below-minimum-wage/#comment-95431</link>
		<dc:creator>katie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:41:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.greens.org.nz/?p=7554#comment-95431</guid>
		<description>Woe betide the rural employee who breaks a limb and needs in-home assistance for daily care activities, then.

I thought the Nat&#039;s were supposed to be representing the rural vote?
Obviously, they don&#039;t regard those who are incapacitated by their working environment to be part of their constituency...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<div style="">Woe betide the rural employee who breaks a limb and needs in-home assistance for daily care activities, then.</p>
<p>I thought the Nat&#8217;s were supposed to be representing the rural vote?<br />
Obviously, they don&#8217;t regard those who are incapacitated by their working environment to be part of their constituency&#8230;</p></div>
<p>Like or Dislike: <img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="up-95431" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_up.png" alt="Thumb up" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95431', 'add', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_');" /> <small id="karma-95431-up" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">6</small>&nbsp;<img style="padding: 0px; border: none; cursor: pointer;" id="down-95431" src="http://blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/images/1_14_down.png" alt="Thumb down" onclick="javascript:ckratingKarma('95431', 'subtract', 'blog.greens.org.nz/wp-content/plugins/comment-rating/', '1_14_')" /> <small id="karma-95431-down" style="font-size:12px; color:#990033;">0</small> (<small id="karma-95431-total" style="font-size:12px; color:#009933;">+6</small>)</p>
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