I used to get affordable dental care at the Christchurch hospital in the late eighties to mid ninties. Even then it was being run down.

Now with private practices (even subsidised) it is just not affordable.

One dentist had left a swab in my tooth and I tried to get it investigated with a ‘dentel association’ (if they exist) no such luck!!!!

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I think it should be mandatory that dental treatment (whether publicly or privately funded) should be free of amalgam fillings.

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Leaving disabled rights alone for a moment (wheelchair access is woeful in most countries, even London doesn’t have wheelchair access at every tube station) you have to remember that most governments view dental care as a lower priority than general healthcare.

Sad but true, just see the lines of people queueing up for several blocks to register when a new dentist arrives in town in the UK.

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James

Did you not notice that your responses were read and answered and not automatically hidden? That there is a choice you make at the top of the comments that says what level of “ignore” is set and that there is a notation that tells us to click to see the hidden comment? Did you notice that we’ve argued about the default setting of that level specifically because your comments WERE hidden? This isn’t about censorship James, it is about a convenience. Possibly too convenient but as I run around with my default setting high enough that nothing gets blocked I never even noticed that you’d run afoul of it… until you claimed censorship.

We don’t actually do that a lot, you see. Despite the propaganda machine over there on the right.

respectfully
BJ

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LibertyScott

I almost said at least a part of this. That it demeans the term “human right”, because it does, but at the time I was looking at it I didn’t have the time to engage fully.

Then when I did, James was making a more Randian argument which distracted me from the particular truth. This isn’t a human right.

It has much more (as a right) to do with the notion of egalitarian distribution of dental care than the notion of a human right. Which makes it a “redistribution of wealth” issue (as you observe) and as such a socially determined, rather than human, right. If the society wants it, that’s all well and good, but the cost to the society has to be well understood… and it seldom is.

Which is why you get a rec from me. We can argue about the cost and the reasoning behind this redistribution some other time. I am agreeing with you that it is not a “human right”. Thanks for reminding me

respectfully
BJ

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Nice try LS but the petals here will just “hide” you as they want you “out from under your rock into the open and exposed to scrutiny”.

Yes I know that makes no sense to you,me and most thinking people but apparently it does on their planet….

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The idea that access to dental care is a human right comes from the same line of thinking that there is a right to free to air rugby broadcasts, broadband internet etc etc. It is a constant claim for taxpayers to be forced to pay for what people want, rather than to let people choose what to do with their own money, including helping those who cannot afford whatever it is.

The tragedy is that it demeans the term human right when there are genuine human rights, like freedom of speech, which are fundamental and cost nobody at ALL, put alongside what is essentially just an argument for redistribution of wealth, dressed up as a “right”, as if you can’t argue whether it should happen or not.

The simple truth is the Greens want taxpayer funded dental care and taxpayer funded accessibility for all who are disabled. It isn’t a “right” because an MP says it is so.

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Kahikatea,
Well I certainly found that when I tempered my logic with emotion I had a higher standard deviation in terms of happiness, though the mean stayed the same. As a logical person I find the insight it grants at times to be depressing but that in itself is due to a cognitive bias, ironically a lack of logic, instilled in my in my youth which results in a depressive interpritation of events.
On the whole the psychologcial evidence would seem to suggest that it decreases the deviation in emotion but, because of its ability to eliminate cognitive bias, tends to help with psychological problems and happiness in general; especially considering the unhappy events thus avoided. I would say more successful at almost anything so long as that anything involves some degree of challenge; there is a very large body of evidence relating to the strong relation between IQ, logic, etc. and ability to achieve ones aims.

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Sapient wrote: “If we, additionally, teach critical thinking and logic in intermediate and through high-school we should pretty much have it cinched. The teaching of these, especially the cognitive styles, should vastly assist our children in learning and in any achievement in life.”

obviously teaching logic and critical thinking will make people better at finding the truth. But will it make them happier or more successful at what they want to do? Or does less logical thinking have advantages?

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For good mental hygiene, brush with reason Shunda. Either pure reason or sapients preferred mix with empiricism.

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Shunda,
Well in truth, in true Socrates fashion, we can never know reality; it is logically impossible assuming that our senses, or our interpretation of our senses, can be flawed. We can however use our experience, logic, and experimentation to estimate reality; empiricism being the the best method I have yet encountered to do so.
I think that if we encourage parents to use methods of teaching which imprint the superior cognitive styles we will be off to a flying start. If we can get kindergarten teachers and primary school teachers to do the same we should obtain further benefit. If we, additionally, teach critical thinking and logic in intermediate and through high-school we should pretty much have it cinched. The teaching of these, especially the cognitive styles, should vastly assist our children in learning and in any achievement in life.
As to mental health, the therapy-based treatment that is often the most effective, in almost all disorders which are treatable via therapy, is cognitive behavioural therapy; a therapy that teaches patients to think in a different matter which is more adaptive, more logical.

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Thanks, Shunda.

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Keep them away from television.

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“Reality is more important than emotional comfort; at least to me. To not acknowledge reality is to not do all you can to better the life of your off-spring.”

Yes sapient! I was discussing this very issue in depth with someone the other day. But how do we really define reality? The insecure person really does believe everybody is out to get them. How do we encourage people to have good mental “hygiene” in a society that says it is not necessary?

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” (and not because I have much sympathy for supposed deep thinkers who can’t spot the “Click here to see” link right next to “Hidden due to low comment rating”).”

Frog, even though I am sometimes, how shall we say it, an “occasional” antagonist on this blog I have to say you run a pretty tight ship, I think you are fair and you and your hidden froglings deserve to be congratulated, keep up the good work.

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Off-beat Zen Tiger
Finds treasures ‘mongst our discards
Thumbs his nose at us

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After reading the first few “hidden” comments, I assumed they were the good ones, that you opened up to enjoy like a scrumptious chocolate bar.

Some-one click on my comment red thumbs and wrap them up for Christmas!

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BJ,
My moral principle is very similar and I have discussed it here many times. I just find it incredibly important to acknowledge that there is no such thing as a non-arbitary moral system and by extension no such thing as a natural right as those whom claim such rights are everywhere and make a great mess of things.
Reality is more important than emotional comfort; at least to me. To not acknowledge reality is to not do all you can to better the life of your off-spring.

Not every thing can be logically deduced if we as ‘why should we do this’ but if we ask ‘what is the best way to do this given these goals’ and throw in some knowledge then everything becomes solvable. But by imposing an artificial block in logic such as the primary moral you propose, which I do, one is able to use logic to solve any problem when that logic is combined with correct propositions, even an ought. Everything can be made a syllogism, its just some need, or are enhanced by, knowledge (tongs) to form the final product.

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NZ is noticeably gappy if you land at the International Terminal – and, well, it sends a good ole’ third world message out there which is, i suspect, unnecessary….the people have no bread
Cake, anyone?

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…and yes Greenfly… they ARE being a bit precious about this given that the comment has NOT been removed, merely hidden, with controls available to reveal it in all its putrescent glory.

I don’t want them hiding behind it… and I don’t want them going off and claiming they were “censored” here when they slink back under the rocks where they are normally found. It takes too much time and effort to establish the truth once the lie has been told… and someone who casually visiting to check WILL find comments hidden and not even bother to read.

The casual check should reveal the lie for what it is IMHO.

respectfully
BJ

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