B.
My main concern is that we are being colonised and undermined.

Note today the property council is calling for the removal of red tape and changes such as those to height restrictions (= shade out existing houses) to save the economy.

Note also that the Greens have no response to those who attempt to increase immigration even though immigration is one of the adjuncts of the property industry whose aim is to keep prices high (wealthy migrants/foreign owners) while maintaining affordability through subsidised infrastructure and cheap farmland.

“The Greens bang on big time about climate change and cow s*it, when will the “green” party address the population issue?”

Greens have always supported slowing population growth, foreign aid programmes with easy access to contraception, etc. A population policy will be released before the election. Before it comes out, it would be interesting to hear from jh and BP and any others, what you think NZ should be doing to curb world population?

The neo-con mob is adamantly opposed to girls and women having access to anything but the word “no”. This has to do with what appears to be a desire to punish what they view as “immorality” with pregnancy. That is the only way for me to interpret it and I’ve looked at it a lot. This isn’t entirely or even mostly “religious” at that level, and that’s how the law gets to be an elephant sized ass.

The religious belief aspect of it contains philosophical traps of all sorts, and my experience has been that people who reckon that the life that must be protected starts at conception will not and cannot ever agree with people like me (life does not have a known beginning though individual lives end, and the uniqueness of individuals is held in their minds and memories). Nor I with them. It cannot be settled EVER… which makes reliance on the individual beliefs of the women who bear children the only safe approach the state can take.

The problem however, is this.

http://www.earthday.net/footprint/flash.html

We can and do try to reduce our individual “footprints” but I know how much I use, what part of it is irreducible and to what degree I am willing to let the advantages of civilization disappear. That last part is not a Beemer… it is the ability to be educated, have passable medical and dental care, not be hungry or thirsty or so overworked/tired that no new idea can survive the effort to survive.

The point however, is that unless the population IS controlled there is no way that ANY amount of sacrifice on my part or by my children, can make up for the absurdity of continuing uncontrolled population expansion.

Which is my way of saying, “I am DOING my part and the rest of the world must do something too”.

I don’t see that happening. I don’t see acceptance by the rest of the world, except for China, that population is a problem or that limits to growth of population are desirable. Often it is assailed as a plot to keep the minorities as minorities. (sigh… it has that effect too).

However, what is not sustainable WILL NOT be sustained. It will continue until things break and people die fast enough that population starts to decline.

Nobody. anywhere ever, beats the laws of Thermodynamics.

respectfully
BJ

I know Catholics are against contraception but I think other Christians are ok with it.
I do agree with you that many seem to take a reactionary response to abortion and it is a much more complicated issue than many realise.
I think people need to realise that the imediate goal should be to reduce the abortion rate and educate people to be responsible with their fertility.
I think persecuting women who have had an abortion is disgraceful ,anyone who has talked to a woman who is struggling with a previous abortion realises they need support, not religious fanatics calling them a murderer.
I personally don’t like abortion, I think removing a pregnancy cause there aint enough seats in the “beamer” is disgraceful, but I think it would be better to make abortion un-necessary with education, than to out right ban it at the moment.

I agree that lowering the abortion rate should be the goal. It is certainly not the goal in the US, where the anti abortionists who are also against contraception due to their religious beliefs (am biting tongue here to be polite), don’t seem to care that unwanted pregnancies and therefore abortions climb as a result.

By the way, this is the same argument Greens use regarding cannabis use. The goal of our policy is to reduce all sorts of harm from drug use, including reducing usage itself, particularly among young people. In that regard, we’re no different than our arch nemesis on the issue, Peter Dunne, though he is not honest enough to admit it. The only issue is how. Studies the world over show that prohibition has failed in achieving this goal, just as alcohol problems would increase if it became illegal. We don’t accuse prohibitionists of wanting to see more cannabis usage, we just want them to take their blinders off.

Greens have always supported slowing population growth, foreign aid programmes with easy access to contraception, etc. A population policy will be released before the election. Before it comes out, it would be interesting to hear from jh and BP and any others, what you think NZ should be doing to curb world population?

Shunda, the Green Party will and already does work with Christian groups. While I believe a majority of members would be atheists (no idea the real percentage) the official policy is one of tolerance for all religion. So while people may get heaps of flack from individual Greens when the subject turns to talking snakes, the Party itself will not take a position against. There are many members with some religion, though I haven’t come across any evangelicals. Our most famous Christian, of course, is Nandor.

Population issue is the elephant in the room….