Comments on: Cycle safety http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/ hopping along the corridors of power Thu, 18 Mar 2010 11:21:12 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: greengeek http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55597 greengeek Mon, 01 Sep 2008 08:06:28 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55597 Owen, fair point. Maybe we could even apportion the roading $ according to how many innocent people are killed by each mode of transport. Maybe tax the cars according to the real danger they pose. eg: tax each and every diesel 4wd about $5000 per annum as a penalty for the damage they (potentially) do to pedestrians, cyclists, Daihatsu Mira drivers and property. Tax each bike $100 as a token contribution. Gas scooters about $250 Daihatsu Mira drivers about $350. Suzuki Cappucinos about $500. Priuses about $600 Corollas about $1500 Commodores/Falcons about $3000 etc etc I believe we should aim for a continuation of the 'personal fleet' concept, rather than a total reliance on public transport. The point you raise about funding the costs of roads is a valid point. If we all took the bus, where would the tax come from?? Owen, fair point. Maybe we could even apportion the roading $ according to how many innocent people are killed by each mode of transport.

Maybe tax the cars according to the real danger they pose.

eg: tax each and every diesel 4wd about $5000 per annum as a penalty for the damage they (potentially) do to pedestrians, cyclists, Daihatsu Mira drivers and property.

Tax each bike $100 as a token contribution.

Gas scooters about $250

Daihatsu Mira drivers about $350.

Suzuki Cappucinos about $500.

Priuses about $600

Corollas about $1500

Commodores/Falcons about $3000

etc etc

I believe we should aim for a continuation of the ‘personal fleet’ concept, rather than a total reliance on public transport. The point you raise about funding the costs of roads is a valid point.

If we all took the bus, where would the tax come from??

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]]> By: Owen McShane http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55560 Owen McShane Mon, 01 Sep 2008 02:56:41 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55560 It is a sad fact that as cyclists increase in numbers so does their death and accident rate -unless they are able to ride on dedicated cycle ways. The problem is that the people who advocate cycling are strong advocates of motorists paying their full way but seem to believe that cyclists should get a totally free ride. IF they want motorists to pay for cycle lanes out of the petrol tax then don 't be surprised if motorists start saying if we have to pay for our lanes then you should pay for yours. It is a sad fact that as cyclists increase in numbers so does their death and accident rate -unless they are able to ride on dedicated cycle ways.
The problem is that the people who advocate cycling are strong advocates of motorists paying their full way but seem to believe that cyclists should get a totally free ride. IF they want motorists to pay for cycle lanes out of the petrol tax then don ‘t be surprised if motorists start saying if we have to pay for our lanes then you should pay for yours.

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]]> By: Kevyn http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55476 Kevyn Sat, 30 Aug 2008 13:20:15 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55476 kjuv, I think the answer to your question has to be yes. http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/road-user-safety/new-road-rules/rur-qas.html#driveway kjuv, I think the answer to your question has to be yes.

http://www.ltsa.govt.nz/road-user-safety/new-road-rules/rur-qas.html#d riveway

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]]> By: Kevyn http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55475 Kevyn Sat, 30 Aug 2008 13:08:55 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55475 Trevor, I stand corrected. Definitely showing my age to repeat verbatim what I had drummed into me way back when I was learning to drive. Trevor, I stand corrected. Definitely showing my age to repeat verbatim what I had drummed into me way back when I was learning to drive.

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]]> By: kjuv http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55463 kjuv Sat, 30 Aug 2008 08:46:06 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55463 Kevyn says: Oh no, the footpath has the same legal status as a marked pedestrian crossing. Thanks for that. So just to clarify: Does that a driver of a car hitting a pedestrian on a footpath crossing a driveway would automatically be in the wrong? (I can well imagine small children or people running on the footpath without taking any cognisance of driveway activity.) Kevyn says: Oh no, the footpath has the same legal status as a marked pedestrian crossing.

Thanks for that. So just to clarify: Does that a driver of a car hitting a pedestrian on a footpath crossing a driveway would automatically be in the wrong? (I can well imagine small children or people running on the footpath without taking any cognisance of driveway activity.)

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]]> By: Trevor29 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55455 Trevor29 Sat, 30 Aug 2008 07:16:57 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55455 Kevyn - how sure are you that a cyclist in a cycle lane has to be able to stop in half the visible distance? To me, that would assume the possibility of another cyclist travelling in the opposite direction in the same lane. If the cycle lane is a lane marked on the road, then it should be usable in only one direction, and would then have the same status as any other road lane or a road with a marked centre line, which requires the vehicles (cycles in this case) to be able to stop within the visible clear road. Trevor. Kevyn – how sure are you that a cyclist in a cycle lane has to be able to stop in half the visible distance? To me, that would assume the possibility of another cyclist travelling in the opposite direction in the same lane. If the cycle lane is a lane marked on the road, then it should be usable in only one direction, and would then have the same status as any other road lane or a road with a marked centre line, which requires the vehicles (cycles in this case) to be able to stop within the visible clear road.

Trevor.

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]]> By: Kevyn http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55454 Kevyn Sat, 30 Aug 2008 07:04:47 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55454 kjuv, Oh no, the footpath has the same legal status as a marked pedestrian crossing. I don't actually know what the legal status is at T intersection or a major/minor crossroad. Is the footpath deemed to continue across the T or not? When I'm driving I assume it is and when I'm walking I assume it isn't. That seems to be the safest approach. kjuv, Oh no, the footpath has the same legal status as a marked pedestrian crossing. I don’t actually know what the legal status is at T intersection or a major/minor crossroad. Is the footpath deemed to continue across the T or not? When I’m driving I assume it is and when I’m walking I assume it isn’t. That seems to be the safest approach.

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]]> By: greengeek http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55443 greengeek Sat, 30 Aug 2008 05:51:04 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55443 Hey, thanks for providing the link re the cycling action petition. I hadn't heard about it and am pleased I got the chance to sign before it was too late. cheers. Hey, thanks for providing the link re the cycling action petition. I hadn’t heard about it and am pleased I got the chance to sign before it was too late. cheers.

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]]> By: kjuv http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55442 kjuv Sat, 30 Aug 2008 05:37:58 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55442 Kevyn Says: (legally every driveway entrance is an intersection). Oh.. does that mean that pedestrians do not always have right of way on the footpath when crossing over a driveway? Kevyn Says: (legally every driveway entrance is an intersection).

Oh.. does that mean that pedestrians do not always have right of way on the footpath when crossing over a driveway?

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]]> By: Kevyn http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55431 Kevyn Sat, 30 Aug 2008 02:15:14 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55431 Location photo without the peak traffic. http://www.panoramio.com/photo/4679995 Location photo without the peak traffic.
http://www.panoramio.com/photo/4679995

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]]> By: Kevyn http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55430 Kevyn Sat, 30 Aug 2008 02:07:47 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55430 Here is some more detail on the crash. It happened approaching major road works on the main City to Sumner road at 5.30pm, so the speed of cars will not have been part of the cause. In these particular circumstances wherein a cyclist is able to travel freely in a cycle lane alongside stationary lanes of cars there is a legal obligation on the cyclist to travel at a speed at which they can stop "within half the length of the visible roadway" or at a speed which is not "too fast for the conditions". The same is true for buses in bus lanes with the <i> crucial </i> difference that buses are visible to turning drivers at a greater distance from the intersection (legally every driveway entrance is an intersection). See the road layout (Ferry Rd/Humphey's Dr) here: http://maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&tab=wl Comments from Steve Gurney and Derek Erasmus on Christchurch cycling injuries here: http://www.stuff.co.nz/thepress/4570265a6009.html Here is some more detail on the crash. It happened approaching major road works on the main City to Sumner road at 5.30pm, so the speed of cars will not have been part of the cause.

In these particular circumstances wherein a cyclist is able to travel freely in a cycle lane alongside stationary lanes of cars there is a legal obligation on the cyclist to travel at a speed at which they can stop “within half the length of the visible roadway” or at a speed which is not “too fast for the conditions”. The same is true for buses in bus lanes with the crucial difference that buses are visible to turning drivers at a greater distance from the intersection (legally every driveway entrance is an intersection).

See the road layout (Ferry Rd/Humphey’s Dr) here:
http://maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

Comments from Steve Gurney and Derek Erasmus on Christchurch cycling injuries here:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/thepress/4570265a6009.html

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]]> By: jh http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55413 jh Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:24:09 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55413 What someone needs to invent is a shopping basket bike trailor. You raise it at the supermarket and lower it when attaching it to the bike. What someone needs to invent is a shopping basket bike trailor. You raise it at the supermarket and lower it when attaching it to the bike.

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]]> By: Shunda barunda http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55406 Shunda barunda Fri, 29 Aug 2008 23:47:27 +0000 http://blog.greens.org.nz/2008/08/30/cycle-safety/#comment-55406 SO you are suggesting a lower open road speed limit than 100km hr? SO you are suggesting a lower open road speed limit than 100km hr?

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