“the hui will discuss how we/us you and all of us are going to take back aotearoa from the baldyheads to expel the britishers, the kaupapa of the hui is to set a plan of action in place to assist in bringing this about, independence and self determination we will all decide as to what and how we move on this ideally we want to perform an action on waitangi day that will shock the world.”

“go to the one in wgtn at the oblong left bank cuba street that’s where you can find out about the fake us, canada, america and english pernicious resource stripping war mongering industrialists nations and how to overthrow them. ”

“There are the petty crime games, steal anything and everything it is muru. Burn it or destroy whatever you steal or distribute it if this is for example 1&2. It there is any profit from it give ten to 20% of it to any iwi political organisation,” like the whanau.

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Sapient

Pi**ing my self laughing

The point, is that a week in politics is a long time and the vagaries of the world defy prediction. As for well though out – sorry, it was just mental rambling from the brain to the fingers with not much in between.

go well.

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very young; comparativly.
naive; debatable.
care to state why I am so naive, Janine? I do so love to enhance myself!

Strings, well thought out story, but i kinda miss the point? how plausable it is depends mostly on the state of the media at the time i suppose.
PMSL?

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Sapient really is very young and naive isn’t he?

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Sapient
PMSL
I knew your tongue was in your cheek m8, but there’s a lot here who don’t understand what that means!

One interesting thing about the UN right now, is that it hasn’t paid rent on the NYC building for years, as the US hasn’t paid its dues for the same period! Wonderful how these things happen isn’t it! Anyway, just imagine the scenario . . . . . . . .

The USA invades the UK as it finds it needs a stronghold in Europe that is independent of the Euro. England decides that before it lays back and enjoys it (as a pope once said to nuns in Africa) it should put up a token resistance, so appeals to the UN for help. The UN schedules a meeting, to arrange a meeting, to work out how a meeting of the security council can be held without two of the permanent members being allowed in. This meeting establishes a working party, reporting to a sub-committee, that agrees to liaise with the European Union’s Committee on invasions and deterrents thereto prior to delivering its report back to the committee so that the suspended meeting can be rescheduled for continuation. After hearing of this development, half the UK population take flight to Florida and seek asylum while the other half loots what is left behind in the hope that they will be declared mentally unfit to be tried on the basis that the original owners didn’t want the junk so why would anyone else? The USA completes its sequestering of the UK, and negotiates an agreement with the monarchy whereby the daughter of the current president will marry Prince William, and these two will form the basis of a dynasty of heads of state (HOS) for the newly expanded Union, leaving the president to get on with the serious job of being Commander in Chief. The societal wannabees of Boston, New York, San Francisco, etc., all move to the UK to clearly show their high social positioning. Because the new HOS is not “royal” and does not hold a “crown”, all treaties and agreements with prior dominions are rescinded, and those prior dominions are offered statehood (so long as they have an aggregate population equal to or greater than Alaska, ) or independence as their legislation’s decide.

MOst MAori Activists and legal council (MOMALs) relocate to London where they proceed to attempt to negotiate compensation for the loss of earnings and benefits from Treaty Negotiations they had enjoyed prior to the US invasion of the UK. After 45 years of lobbying and requesting audience, they finally get the message that the legislature of the US is in Dulles, not Durham, County, and fly to Washington Dulles airport, where they are refused entry on account of being aliens without the appropriate visas. When they appeal to NZ (now renamed New Aotearoa to remove the Dutch association) for diplomatic assistance, the response is “who? you want what? where were you travelling from? Guantanamo beckons.

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LOL, strings, i was mearly making a point. I do not expect any help from the U.N. should there be a violent upraising, my point with the U.N. mention was that international treties and agreements also come into play, for example we all know the only reason america does not invade every other country is because unless it can justify it to the U.N. to some degree it will meet with resistance from the other countries eventually.
another note; if the maori are given a peice of land, including soveriegnty over that land, by the government and are protected in that by the government they gain that right also since they are through agreements protecting the land until the government changes its mind. my point is that there is no right to land that you can not defend from enchrochment.

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“if the maori can muster an army and protect the land above auckland to such a degree that the state considers it not worth protecting or aquiring then that group has complete rights to the land.”

Sharemarket tip – invest in sandbags. I’m heading out to dig my bunker now and avoid the rush.

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not even in the Ureweras

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Sapient

You might want to read a bit about the LTTE (Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam) to find out about ‘taking and holding the country north of Auckland. Especially the help, or lack of it, they’ve had from bodies like the UN.
It might open your eyes to realities we don’t often have to be confronted with here in Aotearoa.

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I like the bit in trev’s article about the “national Question”…. : working on indigenous issues to stir up dissent. It projects a big question mark on the far left (yes I believe we have them)’s rationale behind Te tiriti everything.
Peolpe will also be thinking “WTF’s an An R kist”?
“A holden Ute……….” “Naaaaaa!”

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You forgot the bit in the article where the Green member tells everyone (on the Green Party members only forum) to keep their traps shut as this is fr”’gin serious and not to talk to the “filth”… (police).

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“Are you able to paint me a picture of how you see New Zealand in 2020 with the treaty fully implemented?”
Easy:
The treaty is between Tangata Whenua and the Crown
Tangata Whenua= all born New Zealanders
Crown=Prince Charles… woops his ears are too big, scrub the last part!

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sam,
indeed, that is how the world works. if the maori can muster an army and protect the land above auckland to such a degree that the state considers it not worth protecting or aquiring then that group has complete rights to the land. but then again, one does not need an army of their own when they can use the force of international agreements to utilise the coercive forces of other bodies such as the U.N..

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“Those with the right to the land are the citizens of the nation of new zealand who together exert coercive force over the lands of new zealand through the institution of state.”

Yikes! So anybody who can muster a successful coup or armed rebellion can claim a ‘right’ to the spoils!

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Trev’s article is quite lucid, I recommend it.

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every individual has the freedom to any part of the earth, however no individual has the right to anything unless they can muster enough force to coerce others into not claiming it and in doing so protect their possesion of the object. That is to say; Maori do not have any more right to New Zealand land and resources than Australians, Americans or Chinese. Those with the right to the land are the citizens of the nation of new zealand who together exert coercive force over the lands of new zealand through the institution of state. ‘Race’ or ethnicity does not grant you rights; membership to a contract group does.

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treesoftomorrow,

Are you able to paint me a picture of how you see New Zealand in 2020 wityh the treaty fully implemented?

Every time I ask anyone who says the treaty is the overarching document for New Zealand society to paint his picture, they cant answer.

So please, paint that picture of New Zealand society with the treaty fully honoured for me.

Because when you do you may just get people to agree with you as I suspect that nobody has explained to them either how the treaty will work in New Zealand society in 2020.

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the treaty is a living document, not a tomb of the past. it has on going relevence.

its good to know that white supremecy and imperialist views are alive and kicking in NZ these days:

‘… why can’t Maori just f**k off. We won, eat that.’ –
JH

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For a start, WTF is a University of TECHNOLOGY doing with an employee portrayed as an academic and leading Treaty expert? When we have so many Universities for so few people, the least we can do is demand that they keep to some mandate of subject coverage and avoid expensive and unnecessary overlap.

Having said that, my main point is that delivering to the left one of the things they most desire is the way to permanently resolve all Treaty issues.

That’s right! We all vote to be a republic with a written constitution (just keep Winston off the group that draft the constitution, infact start with the original US Constitution and see how amendments flow through based on majority plebiscite approval) and there is no longer a Treaty issuie in Aotearoa, as the treaty is with The Crown, and there wouldn’t be one any more!

We could all live as Aotearoans, respecting each other’s culture and ethnicity under constitutional equality. What more could any of us (who are not part of what my Maori cab driver this morning called the Treaty Gravy train mob) want?

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” I think you are the only person who ever asserts this, BB.”

So you dont get out much then?

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