it took hundreds of thousands of years for earth to create energy resources like petroleum and coal..

humans are going to consume most of these in about 100 years..

the consumption patterns of humans are unsustainable in the long run.

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I also agree with the China and India part.

I am from India. The demand for petro-products is very strong in India.

high oil prices are having an effect on the economy, but the demand for oil seems inelastic.

even if oil were to cross $150, the demand in India won’t go down.

already Indian consumers are paying one of the highest prices for petrol (gasoline as in US).

the retail price of petrol in India is around Rs 50 per litre.

This is around $4.5 per US gallon.

out of this nearly half the price is due to taxes.

Break-up of Petrol prices in India

with the economy growing at 8%+, demand for crude oil is only going to go up.

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With rapid development in Asia, the west has new competitors for natural resources like crude oil and coal.

If the west has to survive in this competitive era of fast-vanishing resources, it has no choice, but to make efficient use of these resources.

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http://www.google.co.nz/url?sa=t&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hydr ogen.co.uk%2Fh2%2Ffuelcell_cogeneration.htm&ei=VHI1SNb1L5b8pgTfqNG6DQ& usg=AFQjCNEFDo4fZve-U9lSbF5HcDcxGOMnGA&sig2=mCTjmGUqJY_JGj4_FYrAbw

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Heaps more R & D? That challenge went out to F1 designers in 2006. Most teams will have their solutions racing next year. All it needed was for the problem to be handed over to fast innovative thinkers. You don’t find many of them in big business or big government but there are hundreds of them in F1.
http://www.racecar-engineering.com/articles/f1/182014/f1-kers-flybrid. html
http://www.motortrend.com/features/editorial/112_0803_technologue/inde x.html

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Not really. Cars are vital for transport in rural areas, optional in urban areas. Break each EU country’s car ownership down into regions and you find the most cars per capita in the least densely populated regions. Same thing for the USA. Same thing for New Zealand. Same thing for OECD countries. Nothing weird about it. Census’ from the 1800s included horses and other livestock. Same relationship then too.

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My caution is simply that the big diesel users, freight, farming, forresters and fishermen are going to need much more than the current city bubble hybrids.

Heaps more R & D anyone?

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Altairnano has developed a battery based on nano technology that powers a car for 60 miles and recharges within 10 minutes.”

Great, it looks like their prototype has survived 50 charging cycles. So in 10-15 years once they’ve fixed all the inevitable engineering problems, built vast factories in China and begun to ship them outside the USA at only twice the price of a new ICE-powered car; I’m sure you’ll see the odd wealthy person driving them around in Auckland.

Meanwhile, back on earth, shouldn’t we be preparing to put in place proven solutions that work right now and can be bought off-the-shelf?

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“Isn’t it weird that NZ is probably the number one country in the world when it comes to a love of the Auto.”

Thats cos Japan, in order to support its car industry, has a policy where they levy a massive tax on a car if its over something like 5 years old so it encourages people to buy new cars more often than they would otherwise so Japan has a glut of second hand cars on its hands that they have to offload, which means just about any New Zealand can afford to own a car. Now Kiwis have just got accustomed to driving everywhere.

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Electronic and hybrid vehicle technology is developing rapidly all the time.

Altairnano has developed a battery based on nano technology that powers a car for 60 miles and recharges within 10 minutes.

http://media.cleantech.com/node/784
http://www.evworld.com/article.cfm?storyid=1258

There is now a retrofit kit now available that also include hotswappable battery kits.
http://www.autoindustry.co.uk/news/24-04-08_10

Kevyn

As you said in another thread the economics of the 1950s weren’t affordable then and even less so now cos of our massive current account deficit. No use looking back to the past. We gotta move on and think what we can do for the future taking into account modern realities.

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The sad thing is NZ is like a 1960’s america still listening to GM and Oil, Lets build motorways in Auckland go on lets do it.

Lets Quote the brought and paid for dis-honorable MP Dr Cullen
Auckland is different and only highways will work. In 10 years time are Aucklanders going to be allowed to tar and feather Cullen for his stupidity.

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Cost is the only reason against electrified highways

Certainly not technology since I believe the US looked into it in the 1970’s. Thats 38 years ago and only costs, big oil and the car lobby stood in its way. An electrified highway negates the need for advanced battery tech.

Isn’t it weird that NZ is probably the number one country in the world when it comes to a love of the Auto. I mean we are still talking about building more motorways in Auckland. Even the US has given up on trying to build motorways every where.

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And my dad ran the local clothing factory…

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Of my class mates, apart from those whose fathers were farmers/other food producers from land, many of our dads, including mine, rode a bicycle to work as their work was in and around the town. Some caught the bus to travel to the freezzing works, a big employer.

Heaps of our working class families did not have a car, not in the late 40’s, early 50’s. Mums stayed home when we were little then had part-time jobs, either seasonal work, or in the local clothing factory or the cottage hospital. Of the Maori families, the men worked at ‘the works’, the cheese factory, for the local builders or joined the shearing gangs. Again, mostly no private cars.

Of course few of our homes had refrigerators, there was no TV, all our dads had great vege gardens, and very few families aspired to sending their children away for tertiary education. Nurses trained on the job in the hospitals. With nurses’ accomodation.

We did not consider ourselves very poor. A bit ‘hard up’ at times, but not poor. Each little town had a primary school with attached high school, we had a doctor or two, a dentist, the usual butcher, baker, grocery stores. Many stores delivered goods to the homes. Our town had a cheese factory.

Life was so simple so different it does not compare.

However, it is my memory/understanding that Wellington had very good public transport.

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What? But how would all the specuvestors be able to afford their $500,000 “investment” properties on a $50,000 income? Where would the flat-screen TVs come from if not hire-purchase or the 4-cars-per-household all bought on eeezy credit from the local car finance dealer?

People must have lived in some kind of serious poverty back then, without even realizing it!

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In a word cost, in two words, sunk cost.

You make it sound like it’s a reality but electric cars are still on the absolute cutting edge of technology and still have a long way to go before they are feasible for widespread use, and consumer acceptance. Who will buy a car with a range of 100km then a 4 hour recharge?

Secondly to re-engineer the roads in the manner you suggest would be mind-bogglingly expensive, better to spend that money on something compatible with the existing infrastructure like PT investment.

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The cost of extracting oil is also increasing quite a lot – an example was the Kashgan oilfield in Khazakhstan, where freezing temperatures for half a year necessitated building islands of some sort for the rigs – very expensive.

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You pay for the electricity you use during the trip this money is used to maintain the highway. Since while you are on the highway you are not driving the car as its on a guiderail you can use that part of your morning commute to check emails read the paper etc. Once you arrive at the exit you leave the highway and start driving your car again on the streets.

Since the highway could return a profit you could even privatize them and allow private companies to build and maintain the road.

Your highway becomes a combined highway/railway which interlinks cities and allows for the delivery of cargo. Its the combining of the personl freedom of the motor car with the efficiency of the train.

Of course you wont get things like that happening in NZ since we no longer like to lead and have instead slipped into a desire to only follow.

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“It would be way more cost-effective if the government invested in energy conservation measures rather than building new generating capacity,”

An oft-repeated statement that is unfortunately not true. The price of energy is low, so it is an inelastic good- most ordinary people spend very little on energy (*apart from petrol) so don’t care enough to use energy frugally. Industrial and commercial users have mostly already put into place efficiency measures where profitable to do so.

Energy efficiency will not offset natural growth in energy usage, full stop. For instance, you need to budget for around 2% increase in electricity generation per year from historical guides.

As for how people will get to work- walk, bus, carpool or bite the wallet and drive. How did people get to work in the 1950s?

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