Green dreams

Too many about powermongering.

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Ah well BJ, that was just the cunning emmission controls favoured by the British and Italian engineers – ‘if it aint going it aint polluting’.

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Can’t say much about the English electrics… had to collect them out of the net we kept under the engine to catch all the various bits as they fell off… its hard to say if they were actually working when they decided to go walkies.

BJ

(( no serious comment intended here ))

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In the future we need to build flat, smooth motorways that are available only to ‘greenfleet’ vehicles like electric bicycles and other lowspeed environmental transport that have a whole new level of technical sophistication (and preferably better electrics than ANY English or Italian car ever had).

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Among the most nonsensical were
* The British Empire was a jolly good thing

Of course it was, if you were British, just look at Labour’s behaviour in the 1930s. We were so eager to prove our Britishness we even managed to declare war on Hitler before Britain did. Ok, that might be myth created by mix up with the international dateline but face facts, if we weren’t British we would never have experienced the heights of technical sophistication, namely the Standard Vanguard and the Humber 80.

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Bigots!… I did think you were above petty name calling, perhaps I was wrong.

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What somebody did in their political past should be irrelevant, even I have voted for the Greens and the Labour party in previous elections.

However it is relevant when they continue to preach communist ideology and introduce hard left legislation into the house.

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People (or at least intelligent thinking people, rather than bigots) do change their views on both issues and ideology over time, as more evidence becomes available to them.

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a) Join the Green party, so that you can have more say in their policies.
or b) Form your own party
or c) Vote for another party
or d) Get on with your life

Cheers,

Miuela

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Oh-err. Pictures or it didn’t happen….

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There are two checks and balances around the repeal of section 59. (1) it was voted for by a majority of our democratically-elected parliament (in fact, a very large majority once National proposed a compromise that most could live with). (2) people are free to elect a future parliament that will change the law back if they want to.

If New Zealand signs a free trade agreement with China, it will not fit either of those conditions. It will only be agreed to by Cabinet, and future parliaments will not be able to simply repeal it. That’s a serious example of a failure of democracy.

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To use an example you would understand, it is the same as the animal welfare debate in New Zealand. Most people who have any scientific ability, and indeed most people with any common sense, from all political persuasions, now know that hens suffer in battery cages. The only people still insisting that the science is unclear are those with a vested interest such as the meat and egg industry, and the government officials and ministers they have bullied into submission.

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I think the difference is that some Greens really do believe capitalism is the cause of all our ills. Myself, I admit I’m a bit confused, but I don’t believe in continual economic growth; I believe we should aim for a sustainable lifestyle where we rediscover values. To me you utilise markets as you would water for a waterwheel.

I would like to see (if it is possible) a wiki which exams the big questions and becomes a policy forge, ie aiming to educate and understand…. better than a few people sitting in a room.

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seeing as the Greens have appropriate decision making as one of our charter principles we have a long history of supporting decentralisation of power
………………………..

Someone ought to do an analysis of green party decision making re the various charter principles.

S59 repeal…. principle of non violence (why not appropriate decision making?)

Noise from speedway…. how do you apply appropriate decision making?..

What if with drawl of troops from Iraq resulted in a bloodbath?

I’m far from convinced that the green Charter is anything but a convienient way to justify whatever policy you want.

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But I also know and accept that social justice, or social responsibility, as I prefer to call it, is an integral way of helping people move towards better choices, and can’t be separated from ecological wisdom.

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> “The two policies you highlight as reasons for not being able to vote for us are tiny, tiny parts of our overall policy, and the reason that you keep stubbing your toe on them instead of policies like energy efficiency, waste, climate change and conservation, is because the sort of stereotyping you display has been disseminated so continuously it’s pretty universal.”

The thing is…anything that I can PERSONALLY do to reduce these bad climatic events and minimise my negative environmental footprint I do already do myself, just because I want to. I don’t need any political party to convince me that it is worth doing.

What I DO need is a political party that understands how great is the need for EVERYONE ELSE to focus on sustainability and renewability aswell. I need a political party that deals with facts, and has enough credibility that it is able to convince non-believers about what is right.

I have not, so far, been able to view the Greens as being helpful in achieving that objective of convincing non-believers that the environment is the one most important issue. You might find that hard to believe.

As Stuey pointed out, I need to put more time into reviewing the Greens manifesto, and am doing so, but the reality is this: I and other voters like myself judge the Greens by their public profile and public efforts.

It is pointless to suggest that we need to accept the whole gamut of Greens policies, because we simply don’t. There are plenty of other parties who are good enough to keep the country ticking over.

In that respect, it really doesn’t matter whether Labour or National gain power, all that matters is that facts, science, common sense, and good dialogue succeed in conveying the environmental message to the masses and force the hand of the major parties.

I struggle to understand how the nay-sayers can deny the probability of humans having hastened climatic instability.

Equally I struggle to understand why the Greens publicly spend so much time worrying about the Dalai Lama, cannabis use and other issues like the smacking thing etc etc.

I guess that is the reality of politics…well-intentioned people get bogged down with the temptation to interfere in things they shouldnt mess with, to the detriment of their focus on the things they SHOULD mess with.

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